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25 Comments

  1. I want to say this was a great article but I need to disagree slightly on one thing. Ammo prices between the 308 and the 6.5, when it comes to 308 the surplus market is spotty for bolt guns, a majority of modern bolt guns have trouble dealing with the hardened primer cups on milsurp ammo so that generally removes the $0.50 a round surplus from the equation. So then you look at the Winchester white box and similar commercial cheap 308 in the $11-13 a box range as the bottom price, seller and Bellot makes a 140gr 6.5 ammo that is brass cased and reload able that sells in the $12-13 a box range, but it isn’t FMJ like the 308 it’s either a soft point or they have a BTHP match ammo for that price range. So comparing apples to apples the 6.5 can be equal or cheaper then 308 when comparing like bullet types

  2. Go read Boston’s Gun Bible written 15 years ago. He points out that the 6.5 Creedmore is what the .308 should have been from the beggining. Hard to argue with the same weight bullet in a higher ballistic coefficient. The 6.5 Grendel with lighter bullets would have been a better cartridge than the .223. So at this point in time we have what we have accumulated. I have been to numerous long range schools and competitions where if 10 shooters of equal skill were on the line, and 1 man showed up with a .308 and everyone else had a 6.5 Creedmore, the best the .308 shooter could hope for was usually around 8th place. 8th place would be due to luck. So yes the 6.5 is ballistically superior to the .308. If I knew I was facing long range on a critical target, I wouldn’t bring either cartridge. I would go with a magnum cartridge. At least a 7mm Rem mag, but more likely the .300 win mag or even the .338 lapua. More energy on target and better ballistics than the .308 or 6.5 Creedmore. In time we will probably see tula and wolf making 6.5 Creedmore. I will still never get rid of my .223 and .308.

  3. My answer would be why not stock all three? If money is an issue then stick with a .223. I don’t see much difference in the 6.5 from a .270 or 6.5 x 55 and good quality bolt guns in that caliber can be had for $400 or so and ammo is common.

    Semi-auto .308 in M1A is my go to gun and I’m too old to change now for a slight gain in ballistics. Most people will not shoot anything past 300 yards unless they practice A LOT so good luck.

    1. Cactus

      I agree on the .308 and the rifle type. My M1A Socom would be my run out the door bug out rifle if I had to just grab one long gun. I once shot a ( probably couldn’t do it again ) 3 shot group ( from the bench ) of slightly over an inch using Silver Bear zinc plated .308 147 gr ammo. I had witnesses. Not bragging but only noting the rifle is very accurate if built on a Wednesday, ha.

      One of my customers told me how effective his 6.5 is on white tails deer. He is very impressed by several one shot kills. I agree it’s a very nice cartridge but how many different calibers can you have and stock? I already have to many. Maybe if I lived out west I’d get one. Longer shots there than back here in WI.

  4. I worked at an indoor range with an indoor 100yd rifle range for a long time, and the one thing I did notice was that while .223 and .308 rifles were particular about what ammo they would shoot well, every 6.5 Creedmoor rifle I shot was very accurate with everything you put in it. It also didn’t matter what brand of rifle it was or how expensive it was. That was what impressed me most about that cartridge.

    2. Pinecone One……. The shortcomings in price and availability are well understood by those of us who have had extensive experience with the Creedmore. That said, the advantages at long range are significant when examining the cartridge purely within the sniper role. A few hundred rounds of carefully selected and tested factory or precision reloads could last a very long time for the survivalist sniper. A well built rifle in 6.5, can not only be shot well by most, it’s incredible accuracy and precision make it fully capable of touching those who would bring you harm at ridiculously LONGGGGGGG RANGES…….. Sorry for yelling.

  5. My uncle was a police sniper and an old friend of mine placed 5th in the Military Nationals at 600 yards. Both excellent long range shooters and both emphatically stated the 6.5 caliber was the best long range caliber at least until you get into something extreme. My uncle had a custom made 6.5-06 that was a very good 1000 yard gun. He spent his last days in Wyoming and shot a lot of prairie dogs with it at extreme range. It was the most accurate gun I have ever shot by far. He loved that rifle.

    That said, I have nothing in 6.5. Maybe some day.

  8. While I can certainly imagine a situation in a world gone feral that I might need to take a thousand yard shot, I consider it to be very unlikely. I am sure that few deer hunters in the US will be switching to the 6.5 Creedmoor.

    Of course, this isn’t a gun forum, as such, but firearms discussions are appropriate as they obviously touch on their applications for survival uses. Even in a survival situation, however, explaining the need to use deadly force at 1000 yards could be problematic when order is restored. Just sayin’.

    Were I 30 years younger and if I didn’t have as much invested in .300 Winchester Magnum, .308, and 5.56 ammo, I just might give the 6.5 Creedmoor a try. Given the terrain in which I live and the likelihood that I would even need to use the .300 Winchester Magnum, I will stick to what I have.

    I believe that the Army placed an order for a 6.8 mm firearm in the past year. I don’t know anything about its ballistics. I’m wondering how that will work out and whether the 6.8 mm will be serious competition for the 6.5 Creedmoor. If it does, will the 6.5 Creedmoor be the new .41 Magnum or 10 mm? They were the shiny new toy until they weren’t anymore.

    1. 1000 yard shots may be hard to justify as defensive, but the feedback I get from veterans from the Middle East is that out in the countryside, if both groups are armed only with carbine calibers, there is a very quick filtering of engagement range to somewhere in excess of 300 yards, and most typically around 500.
      In that case, having a Designated Marksman with a rifle capable of reliably making 1 minute shots out to 600 yards or so is decisive, even for defense of a static position. Which incidentally is exactly what our military has gone to with the M110.

      1. By coincidence, my son was a cav scout in Iraq and was a designated marksman for his unit in the 101st Airborne. He carried both an M4 and an M14. (That doesn’t add anything to my credentials, of course.)

        I have a friend who lives in Utah. It is possible for him to see 1000 yards, and more, in almost every direction from his home. I get this. Most readers don’t live in such circumstances, however.

        All I am saying is that, with the prevailing laws in this country, after a person with bad intent has removed himself as a threat, law enforcement will come down hard on the shooter who uses deadly force. A storekeeper, for example, can’t track down a robber three blocks away and kill him and expect the DA not to prosecute.

        During the period the world has turned feral, one might apply the “3 S Solution.” “Shoot, shovel, and shut up.” Afterward, questions might be asked.

  9. You shoot 1,000 yards for fun. When Schumer hits I’ll take my 100 to 400 yard 7.62 by 39 and 51 any day. They make nice big holes with shock and anything hit by them practically anywhere are out of the game. I can find the rounds virtually anywhere with large selection.
    In the army training it was drilled into our heads KISS. Keep it simple stupid. Not that I think anyone is stupid mind you 🙂

  11. 6,5 cred has become my go to ,it replaced the 264 win when it needed it’s second barrel ,have setup 6.5 cred uppers on the AR 10s , for my saddle rifle it’s a ruger American 6.5 cred with a 1to 4 30mm scope , replacing a win 94 in 25 35 I look at a rifle as a tool ,wants the best tool for the job ? The cred will shoot across a canyon and still knock down a coyote ,or a bear that’s killing calfs ,
    Ammo is every were now ten years ago I hand loaded now I don’t pick up the brass when I’m out
    The same suppresser off the 308 works ,that’s nice when shooting off horse back ,or playing and shooting out the kitchen door ,have 25,,100,,200 yd gongs ,set up for 800 yds but to much work to chase targets
    Have tryed different bullet wt like 140s the open tip match will just about tear a coyote in half if hit right ,,, not sure that would be a good match on game you were going to try to eat ,
    Like hornady ammo best but have yet to have any truly bad ammo from any brand
    Since I switched to 6.5 haven’t looked at a rack full of others except to play ,
    Just experience from one that’s doing it

    Tea and chocolate

  12. I, like many here, will not be switching out of 7.62 NATO. There are no loads out there in military ball- particularly steel-jacketed machine gun ball, in 6.5 Creed. Why is that important to me? Because I have a thousand trees all over my place, and having the ability to shoot THROUGH trees is valuable.
    What we we have here is an “It’ll gun”. “It’ll do this”, It’ll do that”, but when it hits the Westinghouse, little of this will matter. We haven’t seen any armor piercing ammo in 6.5, and likely never will. If the government develops one, it won’t be released to the public for general sale.
    Waiting for someone to compare any (every) 6.5 load to 7.62 NATO on live trees. I’ll bet on the NATO round every time.
    Barrel life on the 7.62/.308 is at least ten times what it is on 6.5. The Army Marksmanship Training Unit at Benning doesn’t re-barrel their practice M14s until around 80,000. But they clean their barrels (or at least leave them wet with Hoppes #9 overnight, every day.
    Leaving copper fouling in a bore is a major cause of accuracy problems over the life of the barrel, assuming you’re not using a bore burner like 6.5 Creed, .264 Win Mag, 7mm Rem Mag, and the other over-bore cartridges. Screaming performance has a price. Hope you have an armorer and a supply of spare barrels. Or, you can just use proven, widely available, established calibers that have “gotten it done” all over the globe for 65 years.
    The 6.5 is great for shooters who love to tinker and punch holes in cardboard at a range.

  13. IMHO .308 Winchester is way more versatile all round. Like the 30-06, it gets the job done, which is what matters. Spend your extra dollars on other things–like food and toilet paper.

  15. One important thing that I thought was not discussed is suitability for different types of actions.
    6.5 Creedmoor was designed from the ground up as the most efficient platform for 6.5mm 120-142gr bullets. As such, it has a steep shoulder angle and less wall taper than the .308 Win. In my mind, this makes the Creed really only suitable for bolt actions, whereas the .308 was designed to be suitable for fully automatic firearms.
    So: I have a purpose built .308 AR10 DMR rifle with an 18″ barrel and 3-15x scope. It’s effective range is 800 yards but it’s not terribly hampered in urban style operations (I find it interesting that the US military is currently reworking the M110 platform in this direction.) My “Ma Bell” rifle is a .338 Lapua Mag that I’m working up to shooting at one mile, but it’s ridiculously easy to shoot at 1000 yards with it. For me, this seems to leave a very narrow niche for a 6.5 Creed, at least from a tactical standpoint.
    Don’t get me wrong, my next project is to rebarrel an old .308 tactical style bolt rifle to 6.5 Creed, but it will mainly be for PRS matches to keep developing skills.
    If someone owned nothing but AR15 platform rifles and wanted to add one single bolt gun for precision work out to 1k, I think 6.5 Creed fits that bill perfectly.

  16. 308, 5.56 , when shtf how those two will be easier to find or trade for than a what??? Now if you think shtf will never happen, then by all means go for it.

  17. For more of a midway point between 5.55 and 7.62 x 51, it seems that the .243 is a well-established, very common caliber. If upgraded to 1:9 twist, and loaded with a 120-grain projectile, it has quite a ballistic coefficient, low recoil, lower cartridge weight. But the 100-grain version that is on all the store shelves is pretty effective anywhere in the rifleman’s quarter mile. And if you want, you can lighten the cartridge up all the way to 55 grain projectiles. However, it is a civilian cartridge, with no supply of surplus linked ammo, tracers, or AP.

    1. Looks like memory got confused there between .243 and .257, for weight and twist. .243 seems to top out at about 107 grains with accelerated twist, with 95 being near ideal for maximum aerodynamics in the common twist rate of barrels.

  19. When I was hunting in Newfoundland we went into the local super center which was about 600 sq. ft. in area and had one gas pump out front. I checked out the ammo they had on the shelf and it consisted of one box of 30-06 and one box of 45-70. When I think of having a gun in a SHTF scenario I think of having something in a caliber that is real common. I don’t think it would be 6.5 creedmore. I’ll stick with my 308 or 30/30. Lots of that ammo around.

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